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View Poll Results: What system would you prefer for overall points? (vote only if you Autoslalom!)

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  • Street & Performance Classes w/ Raw Times

    10 66.67%
  • PAX Index

    5 33.33%
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Thread: PAX Index for Autoslalom

  1. #16
    Senior Member test D_Thissen's Avatar
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    Re: PAX Index for Autoslalom

    I agree with Nabs, if the courses were larger than I think PAX would be a great idea. I also see where Marc is coming from. If you look at the different classes in the SCCA rules, it might be difficult to class the cars.

    Why not class cars based on F/I and N/A instead Street and Performance tires? That way Nabs would be able to play with his boosted friends . You could break it down further into F/I and N/A that are stock, and those with supporting mods (exhaust/tune/suspension/brakes/tires). You would have 4 classes instead of just 2. That might level the playing field a bit. Lets be honest, there's no reason a stock accent should be competing against tropical trunks lol.

    Just my $0.02
    Last edited by D_Thissen; 03-14-2015 at 11:06 AM.

    2013 Argento FR-S

  2. #17
    Administrator test MarcGSR's Avatar
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    Re: PAX Index for Autoslalom

    It's easy to figure out your SCCA class, you have lowering springs which puts you in Street Touring Xtreme (STX) and I see what you're saying but how many FI cars come out? Kevin, Justin, Curtis/Kattty, Eric, Nabs and Cale? Most of those show up here and there. So, realistically, only 2 or 3 boosted cars. Curtis is right, classing is tough. Each system has it's pros and cons, but which is best?

  3. #18
    Premium Member test Nabs's Avatar
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    Re: PAX Index for Autoslalom

    Quote Originally Posted by Curtis_conway View Post
    I find the r comp talk to be irrelevant because the ones who complain aren't even close to the top of the performance tire class.
    Ouch... I think I did pretty well the last time I went out... I even got an amazing dash plaque, that I lost.


    Quote Originally Posted by D_Thissen View Post
    Why not class cars based on F/I and N/A instead Street and Performance tires? That way Nabs would be able to play with his boosted friends .
    My car doesn't even make boost at the dominion lot! The turbo only spools when I leave it in first but then it just bucks and only goes up to 3psi on the straight stretch, if I'm lucky
    "Exhaust gases go into the turbocharger and spin it, witchcraft happens and you go faster"

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  4. #19
    I'm a HATER! test MiniD1CK5's Avatar
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    Re: PAX Index for Autoslalom

    Everyone has access to the same tires, if you want to compete with the big boys buy big boy tires. In a small lot like we have PAX won't work because it will favour small stock cars too much. I don't get what is wrong with the class system we have now? I do think the 300 treadwear limit for "performance" tires is too high though, most places its 180-200 and under. Let the whiners whine, if they that's racing, if you see that sticky rubber works go buy some or be content to trail the leaders.
    FUNCTION >FORM

    Randy Probst's take on the BRZ "it's like a BMW and a Lotus had a baby"

    "Adding power makes you faster on the straights. Subtracting weight makes you faster everywhere." -Colin Chapman

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  5. #20
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    Re: PAX Index for Autoslalom

    If you use this system then you better have a fully prepped course so the performance cars can actually perform. R comp tires and horsepower don't gain anything on a gravel covered parking lot.
    I wish we were at the level where we can compare ourselves to national events but we need to be realistic, none of the cars that compete are built specifically for these events. We are all running street cars that have modifications that may or may not give an advantage around a bumpy dirty course.
    This reminds me of bracket racing, now it will actually be the slowest cars that are consistent that will take home the trophies and all the spectators will be baffled why grandma's car is beating all the tuner cars.
    How many seconds will I get off my time if I take the motor out of my car and push it around the track? Better yet, lets just eliminate the cars all together and run around the track, that is the ultimate test for the drivers...

  6. #21
    I'm a HATER! test MiniD1CK5's Avatar
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    Re: PAX Index for Autoslalom

    I know of one integra that could compete on a national level.
    FUNCTION >FORM

    Randy Probst's take on the BRZ "it's like a BMW and a Lotus had a baby"

    "Adding power makes you faster on the straights. Subtracting weight makes you faster everywhere." -Colin Chapman

    "He who shall be last, shall be sideways and smiling"

  7. #22
    Junior Member Dan's Avatar
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    Re: PAX Index for Autoslalom

    We should pick the system that most people want. I think the poll is a good idea but we need way more votes to determine what the majority of people want to see who come out to the slalom. Whichever way it goes, were going to have people agree and disagree, nothing can be done about that. Above all we should do what brings out the most participants and spectators to the races so that the popularity of the club and slalom grow.

    I agree that at the dominion lot cars with mods and sticky tires can't use them entirely to their full potential but from my experience when I got my better tires I immediately gained an advantage from the first year or 2 that I participated and perhaps my skill improved a bit too. Ever car is going to be different on a case by case basis but I couldn't keep my power down with my other 440 treadwear tires.

    I honestly didn't look up how the PAX system handicaps me but I think it be better if we handicapped people based on hp/weight ratio and how well your vehicle handles and then it's up to driver ability. HP/weight is hard to gauge too when F/I cars don't have the room to spool up in the dominion lot anyways. But then how do you determine's someone's hp with mods, etc. Not like we have a dyno we can test everyone's car out and do we test handling based on g's and were not going to determine that on everyone's car either.

    If we stay with 2 treadwear classes I'd like to see the max performance treadwear come down to the the mid 200's or 200 as some top cars in the street class are outperforming performance at certain events. This will allow the slower cars in the street class a chance to place in the top 3 as well. Or perhaps make a 3rd class. ie. 0-160, 160-260, 260+ Something like that anyways. Were all out there for fun but I'm sure anyone who comes out wouldn't mind placing and if you want to win bad enough you'll mod your car and invest the time and money to gain an advantage and make your car perform so that its funner to participate as well.

    If we go to more classes and if we only have 18 cars averaging to the events we'll have classes which we only have 2 cars in certain classes which isn't more fun and then were giving out 12 dash cards/trophies, etc every race. If we split the F/I and N/A it wouldn't be fair as many N/A cars are much quicker than some of F/I cars.

    The vote is almost split 50/50 down the middle with only 11 votes atm. I haven't voted yet as I still want to hear more debate and opinions before I do. We need more votes to see what everyone wants.
    Last edited by Dan; 03-15-2015 at 01:09 PM.

  8. #23
    Administrator test MarcGSR's Avatar
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    Re: PAX Index for Autoslalom

    Thanks for chiming in Eric and Dan. Regardless how the vote goes, it doesn't mean we will be switching to the PAX system. This thread is to get an idea of where people stand and put ideas out on the table.

    - - - Updated - - -

    IMHO, if we continue with tread wear classes we should have 0-160 (r-comp tires), 180-340(high performance summer), 350+ (all seasons). But we would need more then 2 cars coming out regularly with 0-160 tread wear tires. It's tough to split classes further with only 15-20 cars coming out to events.

  9. #24
    I'm a HATER! test MiniD1CK5's Avatar
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    Re: PAX Index for Autoslalom

    Just drop the performance class tread wear down to less than 200
    FUNCTION >FORM

    Randy Probst's take on the BRZ "it's like a BMW and a Lotus had a baby"

    "Adding power makes you faster on the straights. Subtracting weight makes you faster everywhere." -Colin Chapman

    "He who shall be last, shall be sideways and smiling"

  10. #25
    Premium Member test Nabs's Avatar
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    Re: PAX Index for Autoslalom

    We've been over that a bunch of times, the board won't do it since they don't want to single people out and have 2 people in a class
    "Exhaust gases go into the turbocharger and spin it, witchcraft happens and you go faster"

    ///M3 Journal | E39 540i Journal | Turbo Install | Carbon Roof Time-Lapse Install

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  11. #26
    Junior Member Dan's Avatar
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    Re: PAX Index for Autoslalom

    Quote Originally Posted by Nabs View Post
    We've been over that a bunch of times, the board won't do it since they don't want to single people out and have 2 people in a class
    How about if we go somewhere down to like say 240ish. Check the records quick on a couple races if the treadwear's were noted or not and pick a number to get more cars into the performance category. Or do 3 classes like Marc said but don't go too low on the first, say 0-200, then 200-320ish, 320+, etc. If we don't consistently get 20+ racers at each race(total) in all categories then we might have to keep it to the 2 still.

  12. #27
    Premium Member test Nabs's Avatar
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    Re: PAX Index for Autoslalom

    I'm not sure that treadwear was ever noted, as far as I know. The are only a few people that I can confidently say are running 200 treadwear and most of those people don't show up regularly, including myself, meaning you'd have only a couple people here and there and would have to revert to the 2 classes most of the time.
    "Exhaust gases go into the turbocharger and spin it, witchcraft happens and you go faster"

    ///M3 Journal | E39 540i Journal | Turbo Install | Carbon Roof Time-Lapse Install

    How to: edit posts | post pictures w/ browser | post pictures w/ tapatalk

  13. #28
    I'm a HATER! test MiniD1CK5's Avatar
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    Re: PAX Index for Autoslalom

    Chelsea, yourself, Dan, Dan, katty, Shawn, that white wrx, am I missing anyone? All of them r under 200 treadwear
    FUNCTION >FORM

    Randy Probst's take on the BRZ "it's like a BMW and a Lotus had a baby"

    "Adding power makes you faster on the straights. Subtracting weight makes you faster everywhere." -Colin Chapman

    "He who shall be last, shall be sideways and smiling"

  14. #29
    Senior Member test Curtis_conway's Avatar
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    Re: PAX Index for Autoslalom

    I mean you could have like 10 classes, your only giving out 50 cent plaques anyways...or maybe they could do paper, like bussiness cards then you could do 15 or 20 classes.

    Anyway....look at it as who are you giving trophies to....I mean plaques. Pick something where some random spectator could come out and think to themselfs that they have a chance to win so they dig in there pocket and support the club....cause we all know that the club is dwindling way to fast.

    Please don't kill the club
    Last edited by Curtis_conway; 03-18-2015 at 05:56 AM.

  15. #30
    Administrator test MarcGSR's Avatar
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    Re: PAX Index for Autoslalom

    Quote Originally Posted by MiniD1CK5 View Post
    Chelsea, yourself, Dan, Dan, katty, Shawn, that white wrx, am I missing anyone? All of them r under 200 treadwear
    The only competitors running sub 200 tread wear are Dan and Eric. Which is fine, it would be nice if more people ran r-compounds. It not 'the board' that won't have a class for it but simply the fact you can't have an entire class with one, maybe two competitors. You need /at least/ 3!

    Which is why the PAX system can be fun as it pits everyone against each other and any noob in a stock car has a /chance/ at winning.

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